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d6 against Jobava London

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PatternRecognition

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nc3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

(Edited to correct move to 2. Nc3)

ibrust
PatternRecognition wrote:

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

White will play a pirc against the pirc, not a Jobava.

Your question should be directed toward chigorin players, not Jobava players. This is a chigorin indian position, not the Jobava. And 2. Nc3 is the move, not 2. Nf3:

PatternRecognition
ibrust wrote:
PatternRecognition wrote:

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

White will play a pirc against the pirc, not a Jobava.

Your question should be directed toward chigorin players, not Jobava players. This is a chigorin indian position, not the Jobava. And 2. Nc3 is the move, not 2. Nf3:

 

Interesting 🤔.

I have some follow up questions though...

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nc3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

Strayaningen

You're being a bit obtuse here. The objectively best move after 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nc3 is ...d5, after which White can transpose into a Jobava. OP is correct that after ...d6, White has nothing better than e4, transposing into a main-line Pirc. If White plays Bf4 or something I guess it would technically be an Old Indian.

ibrust
PatternRecognition wrote:
ibrust wrote:
PatternRecognition wrote:

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nf3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

White will play a pirc against the pirc, not a Jobava.

Your question should be directed toward chigorin players, not Jobava players. This is a chigorin indian position, not the Jobava. And 2. Nc3 is the move, not 2. Nf3:

 

Interesting 🤔.

I have some follow up questions though...

Why can't you just play the Pirc against the Jobava? How would a Jobava player respond other than e4?

What would you recommend to a Jobava player if black tried 1. d4 Nf6 2. Nc3 g6 3. Bf4 d6 4. ? ?

The chigorin player would play e4, he has absolutely no reason to not play e4. Before making his 3rd move white can see you're headed for a Pirc, so he is going to play 3. e4, not 3. Bf4. Then if you try to play 3... d5 white can just advance his pawn, 4. e5, and now your knight is tempod and your postition is bad. After 3. e4 the good moves available to you are 3... d6 and 3... Bg7 followed by d6 in the near future, transposing into the Pirc.

This is the Jobava. Notice that d5 is part of the starting position of the Jobava. Without d5 you are not in a Jobava:

This is a kind of pseudo-Jobava... some people call it the e6 Jobava. We can call it a pseudo-Jobava because it usually transposes with the e6 lines in the Jobava. If it didn't, i.e. if someone played d6 here, it'd just end up a crap position:

This is another pseudo-Jobava line, this time with c6... it usually transposes with the c6 lines in the Jobava. This time the transposition occurs when Nf6 is played. Notice all the moves of the starting Jobava position are played, therefor it's a Jobava:

Your position is not a Jobava, it is a position that's headed toward a pirc. Here's how white would play that:

Here's what white would do if you tried to play d5 after e4, this is how white knows you're headed toward a Pirc, because this d5 line is just bad and dumb: 
 
Of course there is a line with g6 in the jobava: 
White could in vain attempt to transpose into that line, hoping black will cooperate and play d5: 
 
But if black plays a Pirc like he's already signaled he intends to... now white finds himself in a crap Pirc where Bf4 is not a useful move, it's just eyeing the d6 pawn. Furthermore, the Pirc is generally favorable for white if he knows how to deal with it, so it'd be setting the bar very low to compromise the position hoping black will throw white a bone and transpose into a jobava. So white doesn't do this: