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suggestions for openings for black against e4

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JonnyLinny
Any suggestions for what opening to play as black against e4?
I’ve tried playing e5 and learning Andrew Toths Chessable course but it’s too much to learn on top of what I’m trying to learn for white e4.
Tried the scandi but I dont enjoy the positions I get into.
Examples of openings I like to play are Evans gambit, Smith Morra gambit, Hennig gambit.
I’m about a 1600 rated online player.
JonnyLinny
Thanks for the detailed reply. I really appreciate it.
Yeah I was thinking the Sicilian, I like an opening with an attacking potential.
Gonna try find an intermediate short and sweet on Chessable and stick with it. At my level including me there shouldn’t be too much theory memorised
JonnyLinny
As long as I get a chance to attack I will enjoy playing an opening. I think I just need to find the right Chessable course
ThrillerFan
JonnyLinny wrote:
Any suggestions for what opening to play as black against e4?
I’ve tried playing e5 and learning Andrew Toths Chessable course but it’s too much to learn on top of what I’m trying to learn for white e4.
Tried the scandi but I dont enjoy the positions I get into.
Examples of openings I like to play are Evans gambit, Smith Morra gambit, Hennig gambit.
I’m about a 1600 rated online player.

Most decent openings have theory of some sort. There are basically four good responses to 1.e4:

1...c5 - The most theory-ridden. There are numerous forms of the Anti-Sicilian, and even the Open Sicilian can have numerous lines. Like in the Najdorf, you have the 5 well known moves, 6.Bg5, 6.Be3, 6.Be2, 6.Bc4, and 6.f4. But then you have 6.h3, 6.Rg1, 6.Bd3, even 6.a4.

1...c6 - The Caro-Kann has the heavily-theorized Advance Variation, the Exchange Variation, the Panov-Botvinnik Attack, the old main line (3.Nc3), the Two Knights, the Fantasy Variation, etc.

1...e6 - The French probably has the fewest unique lines (3.exd5, 3.e5, 3.Nd2, 3.Nc3, 2.d3, 2.b3), but many are heavily theory-ridden, especially 3.Nc3.

1...e5 - There are indeed numerous lines, but you can resolve that problem. If you play one of the main lines of the Ruy Lopez, let's say the Zaitsev, you have the Italian, Scotch, Four Knights, Vienna, King's Gambit, Danish Gambit. Well, you actually can eliminate a lot of that. Yes, you would still need a line against the King's Gambit, Vienna, Danish Gambit, and Four Knights, but you can avoid the Ruy Lopez, Scotch, and Italian by playing the Petroff (a.k.a. The Russian Defense).

sfhhjggfhihftjjtfdft

i think it is e5 the most popular

dcyftukd

Caro kann?

RookMindset
JonnyLinny wrote:
Thanks for the detailed reply. I really appreciate it.
Yeah I was thinking the Sicilian, I like an opening with an attacking potential.
Gonna try find an intermediate short and sweet on Chessable and stick with it. At my level including me there shouldn’t be too much theory memorised

There are no openings where you always get to attack. The Sicilian will give you some attacks fairly often. So will 1…e5. Seeing your love for gambits, I think the Polerio will be right up your alley. Against the Ruy, the Marshall is a great gambit at the club level but as you climb the rating ladder you’ll find more and more people who know too much theory in it, and also with all the Anti-Marshalls there’s about a 20% chance you get a true Marshall out of a Ruy. If you go with Schliemann, you’ll get it on the board far more often, but it’s a bit dubious.

I made a brief blog post on short and sweets. Sorry for the plug but I genuinely think it’s relevant. It covers some stuff against 1. e4 for black (specifically I recommended the Polerio and Open Spanish) and also against 1. d4 and some stuff with White. The other 1…e5 course I like, which I didn’t present in the above blog, is Werle’s e5, which goes for the Chigorin. If you want to play a different Sicilian, I’d go with Plichta’s Accelerated Dragon. Iirc Naroditsky recommended the accelerated dragon as a beginner-friendly sicilian, and the annotations in that course are very good. If you must play Caro, choose L’ami’s course, no glysmith.

One last thing - many people are scared of the 1. e4 e5 sidelines. I find it a bit odd. Most, if not all of these sidelines (by which I mean everything excluding Ruy/Italian/Scotch) can be neutralised with a timely …d5. King’s Gambit? d5. Center Game? d5. Danish? d5. Goring? d5. Vienna Gambit? d5. Ponziani? d5. Halloween Gambit? d5. Nakhmanson? d5. And so on (because I forgot the rest).

dcyftukd

The Latvian gambit is fun

JonnyLinny
Thanks for the detailed replies Rookmindset and ibrust.
I think I am going to give the Sicillian defence a try as black. Will try to stick with it for a few months to give it a real go.
I don’t like playing against so is part of my reasoning.
Hopefully my oppos at my level will know less theory than me.
Thanks for the replies
JonnyLinny
Have you got a link to the blogpost?
RookMindset
JonnyLinny wrote:
Have you got a link to the blogpost?

I embedded it in the comment, but here: https://www.chess.com/blog/RookMindset/free-chess-courses-to-boost-your-opening-knowledge

Out of curiosity, what sicilian did you pick?

AngusByers

One thing to keep in mind when learning an opening as White is to also use that study time to learn the Black side. You need to prepare as White for the most challenging responses by Black after all. That way, if you face that opening but you have the Black pieces, you already have the lines learned. So as you're learning White's side, look for the lines chosen by Black that you wouldn't want to see your opponent play, and learn those as your options as Black.

While White's first move tends to me that Black responds to White rather than determines how things start, there are some decent choice to consider if you want to try and steer the game as Black towards a familiar set up. For that you have a few choices, and it's probably best to look at a few of them and see which ones lead to positions that you are comfortable with. The French, Caro Kann, and Petroff's are all solid and will serve you well no matter how strong you get. The Sicilian is also very good, but of the lot, probably has the most theory to work on. Still, as Black you don't have to know every option, rather you just need to concentrate on which flavour of Sicilian you want to work on.

The others will also require preparing for a number of decent options by White as well, and at some point if you get really strong you will probably have to take the time to learn the Sicilian from both sides.

Eventually you are going to reach the point where your opponent knows how to best respond to whatever you play as White, and you'll drop anything that only works for White through tricks, and you'll drop anything that is bad for Black for the same reason. As such, the opening won't be viewed as "what gives me the advantage" but rather "what gets me to middle game positions I understand and like to play".

chessterd5

The least theory intensive repertoire that I have found for black against 1.e4,... is 1...,d6. And play some type of philidor position. It avoids pretty much all of White's 2nd move alternatives except for weirdness ( which you can't control anyway) or 2.f4,... then you can choose between playing a kings Gambit as black or black can play 2...,c5 and go into a Gran Prix Sicilian.

SwimmerBill

Depends on what you want - should the opponent have similar desires:

If you want to equalize then wait patiently for your chance, play CK or, maybe , classical french.

If you want a sharp game where you counter attack play Winawer or Sicilian.

(I like the white side of 1. e4 e5 so you'd need others to recommend that- but there is nothing wrong with it either.) Whatever you pick, there will be plenty to learn along the way.

All just my opinions of course- Bill

Ethan_Brollier
chessterd5 wrote:

The least theory intensive repertoire that I have found for black against 1.e4,... is 1...,d6. And play some type of philidor position. It avoids pretty much all of White's 2nd move alternatives except for weirdness ( which you can't control anyway) or 2.f4,... then you can choose between playing a kings Gambit as black or black can play 2...,c5 and go into a Gran Prix Sicilian.

Personally I would call the least theory intensive repertoire the Qd8 Scandi. Philidor requires a lot of prep with how many completely viable independent lines there are for White, and everybody knows at least one of them decently well.

This is not the case for the Qd8 Scandi, in which both sides are down a pawn and White is up a tempo. This would be a bad thing except White has no way to push the advantage if Black just plays passive and develops (Nf6 e6 Be7 0-0 a6 Nbd7 b5 Bb7 sort of thing, y'know, the usual) and White can't actually use the tempo advantage because it was gained via 3. Nc3 with tempo on Black's queen on d5, but now without either an e-pawn or a c-pawn, White has no control of the center and therefore also has to play somewhat passively with that tempo advantage, drastically reducing its effectiveness.

RalphHayward

I personally would argue that if one plays a classical opening as White but wants to become an all-round player it might make sense to have something hypermodern in the Black repertoire against 1.e4 be that the Pirc or Modern or Alekhine or even the Owen. In order to get experience not only in grasping the centre and initiative but also in seeking to undermine the centre and seeing chess as a "game of information" looking for the reply which uses the first player's choices against him. The Sicilian (although excellent) has a tendency to also be rather "too much to learn", hypermodern stuff usually doesn't. But there are tactics to be found and enjoyed.

RookMindset

Right now I play 1…e5, and 2. Nf3 Nc6. I’ve played the French before, but I found myself not liking a lot of the positions I got. Great opening, but not for me, though I might give it another try one day. I’ll definitely pick up the Rubinstein French when I turn 60. I don’t have any interest in other openings except for the Sicilian. I think it would be a shame to play chess and never play a Sicilian. Someday I’ll learn Najdorf and/or Sveshnikov.

TheSuperFlash

Scandinavian defense?

scopegranites

The Sicilian Defense is a popular response to 1. e4, creating an unbalanced game with rich tactical and strategic possibilities as Black fights for central control by preparing to play d5 later.

Compadre_J

You could try the Sicilian Dragon!

It’s totally attacking all the time in main lines!