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Why is everyone low rated so ridiculously good?

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BigChessplayer665
greenbean21 wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
greenbean21 wrote:

Coming back to this in September 2024... It's getting stupid. The only time I consistently win is with 85+ accuracy and estimated rating of 1500+. This is against 900's btw. I always have to play at my very best to gain rating points, either due to some weird distribution where all us 900's are underrated, and are antagonizing each other, or there's just a bunch of cheaters.

The rating estimator overvalues 900 playing strength a good chunk of the time you should ignore it

1. Where are you getting this information

2. The accuracy (Maybe the positions are simpler/dryer)

3. I've beaten actual 1400s+ in tournaments if that's a better estimation

It just feels like there's a large pool of underrated 800-1000s keeping each other's rating low. Also, you're 2100 and some of your games are rated 500 points above that, so maybe it's true of all levels.

Cause I was 1600 before that's just my experience with it they seem like they play perfect trust me they are just as annoyed at the amount of blunders they make as you are 1600-1800s are sort of like 800s on steroids

ChrisZifo
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:

This last week I have been ill, and I had a nasty drop in Blitz rating from 1850 way down to 1630.

A lot of the 1600-1700 players I played were putting up 95% accuracy, even over 20 moves, I was sure they were cheating! I do wonder if some players sit there with the grandmaster opening explorer ready, or maybe there are so bots out there. I had about 15 out of 20 opponents at the 1600-1700 level beating me, and when I looked at the analysis I had done very little wrong, and my estimated rating was 1900 and they were 2000 or higher!

I was getting angry and wondering if I was being punished, but then later in the day I got a lot of weak opponents who played 1300-1400 quality and my rating shot up again!

Maybe it is luck? Certain times, you just get people in bad form. Other times you get players who have your number.

Maybe I am just playiing better at certain times and that makes players seem easier?

And maybe when I play bad, and make just one mistake, it allows opponents to play well and get the 90% accuracy. It is weird, especially on Blitz.

I feel like the 1600s are more tryhards so you don't really expect it and play worse than you should

It's the 1700-1800 blitz death spiral intermediates get into

Yeah, I think you are right..

I have played a HUGE number of games on here-- 10s of thousands. It is very hard to get above 1800 on Blitz unless you have a certain kind of talent. Players REALLY do know their openings, the tactics, and how win an endgame.

On Rapid, I reached 2100 playing much the same quality of chess. I guess I think longer and harder because there is more time available-- perhaps that makes all the difference? But I do honestly think Blitz is 200-300 points harder. Try a new opening against a 1900 on Rapid and you will have the same success against a 1600-1700 player on Blitz.

BigChessplayer665
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:

This last week I have been ill, and I had a nasty drop in Blitz rating from 1850 way down to 1630.

A lot of the 1600-1700 players I played were putting up 95% accuracy, even over 20 moves, I was sure they were cheating! I do wonder if some players sit there with the grandmaster opening explorer ready, or maybe there are so bots out there. I had about 15 out of 20 opponents at the 1600-1700 level beating me, and when I looked at the analysis I had done very little wrong, and my estimated rating was 1900 and they were 2000 or higher!

I was getting angry and wondering if I was being punished, but then later in the day I got a lot of weak opponents who played 1300-1400 quality and my rating shot up again!

Maybe it is luck? Certain times, you just get people in bad form. Other times you get players who have your number.

Maybe I am just playiing better at certain times and that makes players seem easier?

And maybe when I play bad, and make just one mistake, it allows opponents to play well and get the 90% accuracy. It is weird, especially on Blitz.

I feel like the 1600s are more tryhards so you don't really expect it and play worse than you should

It's the 1700-1800 blitz death spiral intermediates get into

Yeah, I think you are right..

I have played a HUGE number of games on here-- 10s of thousands. It is very hard to get above 1800 on Blitz unless you have a certain kind of talent. Players REALLY do know their openings, the tactics, and how win an endgame.

On Rapid, I reached 2100 playing much the same quality of chess. I guess I think longer and harder because there is more time available-- perhaps that makes all the difference? But I do honestly think Blitz is 200-300 points harder. Try a new opening against a 1900 on Rapid and you will have the same success against a 1600-1700 player on Blitz.

1600s-1800s are there either the adults that play for years are or the talented people get get good ina couple years past of the issue is the adjustment to playing style is really painful plus 1600-1800 is the range before cheating starts to get incredibly difficult (even if most don't cheat )

IloveIllinois
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

1600s are not that bad.

BigChessplayer665
IloveIllinois wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

1600s are not that bad.

You really don't wanna know what my games where like....

IloveIllinois
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

1600s are not that bad.

You really don't wanna know what my games where like....

If you are talking about Blitz maybe, I don't play that much blitz as I prefer rapid. 1600s in rapid are pretty good though.

ChrisZifo
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:

This last week I have been ill, and I had a nasty drop in Blitz rating from 1850 way down to 1630.

A lot of the 1600-1700 players I played were putting up 95% accuracy, even over 20 moves, I was sure they were cheating! I do wonder if some players sit there with the grandmaster opening explorer ready, or maybe there are so bots out there. I had about 15 out of 20 opponents at the 1600-1700 level beating me, and when I looked at the analysis I had done very little wrong, and my estimated rating was 1900 and they were 2000 or higher!

I was getting angry and wondering if I was being punished, but then later in the day I got a lot of weak opponents who played 1300-1400 quality and my rating shot up again!

Maybe it is luck? Certain times, you just get people in bad form. Other times you get players who have your number.

Maybe I am just playiing better at certain times and that makes players seem easier?

And maybe when I play bad, and make just one mistake, it allows opponents to play well and get the 90% accuracy. It is weird, especially on Blitz.

I feel like the 1600s are more tryhards so you don't really expect it and play worse than you should

It's the 1700-1800 blitz death spiral intermediates get into

Yeah, I think you are right..

I have played a HUGE number of games on here-- 10s of thousands. It is very hard to get above 1800 on Blitz unless you have a certain kind of talent. Players REALLY do know their openings, the tactics, and how win an endgame.

On Rapid, I reached 2100 playing much the same quality of chess. I guess I think longer and harder because there is more time available-- perhaps that makes all the difference? But I do honestly think Blitz is 200-300 points harder. Try a new opening against a 1900 on Rapid and you will have the same success against a 1600-1700 player on Blitz.

1600s-1800s are there either the adults that play for years are or the talented people get get good ina couple years past of the issue is the adjustment to playing style is really painful plus 1600-1800 is the range before cheating starts to get incredibly difficult (even if most don't cheat )

Agreed. You know what you are talking about .

A strange thing I noticed about chess accuracy is that ONE mistake makes all the difference. If one player makes an error, the other player will see the right move and suddenly every move is easier for them. It is like the saying.. "the winner is the player who makes the next to last mistake".

And in openings, especially well known ones, even an inaccuracy can lead to one player playing like a dummy and the other player suddenly becoming Magnus Carlsen for a few moves. It is weird who it works. It is like a balance, and once one side gets an edge, it begins to swing their way.

BigChessplayer665
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:

This last week I have been ill, and I had a nasty drop in Blitz rating from 1850 way down to 1630.

A lot of the 1600-1700 players I played were putting up 95% accuracy, even over 20 moves, I was sure they were cheating! I do wonder if some players sit there with the grandmaster opening explorer ready, or maybe there are so bots out there. I had about 15 out of 20 opponents at the 1600-1700 level beating me, and when I looked at the analysis I had done very little wrong, and my estimated rating was 1900 and they were 2000 or higher!

I was getting angry and wondering if I was being punished, but then later in the day I got a lot of weak opponents who played 1300-1400 quality and my rating shot up again!

Maybe it is luck? Certain times, you just get people in bad form. Other times you get players who have your number.

Maybe I am just playiing better at certain times and that makes players seem easier?

And maybe when I play bad, and make just one mistake, it allows opponents to play well and get the 90% accuracy. It is weird, especially on Blitz.

I feel like the 1600s are more tryhards so you don't really expect it and play worse than you should

It's the 1700-1800 blitz death spiral intermediates get into

Yeah, I think you are right..

I have played a HUGE number of games on here-- 10s of thousands. It is very hard to get above 1800 on Blitz unless you have a certain kind of talent. Players REALLY do know their openings, the tactics, and how win an endgame.

On Rapid, I reached 2100 playing much the same quality of chess. I guess I think longer and harder because there is more time available-- perhaps that makes all the difference? But I do honestly think Blitz is 200-300 points harder. Try a new opening against a 1900 on Rapid and you will have the same success against a 1600-1700 player on Blitz.

1600s-1800s are there either the adults that play for years are or the talented people get get good ina couple years past of the issue is the adjustment to playing style is really painful plus 1600-1800 is the range before cheating starts to get incredibly difficult (even if most don't cheat )

Agreed. You know what you are talking about .

A strange thing I noticed about chess accuracy is that ONE mistake makes all the difference. If one player makes an error, the other player will see the right move and suddenly every move is easier for them. It is like the saying.. "the winner is the player who makes the next to last mistake".

And in openings, especially well known ones, even an inaccuracy can lead to one player playing like a dummy and the other player suddenly becoming Magnus Carlsen for a few moves. It is weird who it works. It is like a balance, and once one side gets an edge, it begins to swing their way.

I just force them to make a mistake if I made one it's not that hard to play down a piece in certain positions

ChrisZifo
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
ChrisZifo wrote:

This last week I have been ill, and I had a nasty drop in Blitz rating from 1850 way down to 1630.

A lot of the 1600-1700 players I played were putting up 95% accuracy, even over 20 moves, I was sure they were cheating! I do wonder if some players sit there with the grandmaster opening explorer ready, or maybe there are so bots out there. I had about 15 out of 20 opponents at the 1600-1700 level beating me, and when I looked at the analysis I had done very little wrong, and my estimated rating was 1900 and they were 2000 or higher!

I was getting angry and wondering if I was being punished, but then later in the day I got a lot of weak opponents who played 1300-1400 quality and my rating shot up again!

Maybe it is luck? Certain times, you just get people in bad form. Other times you get players who have your number.

Maybe I am just playiing better at certain times and that makes players seem easier?

And maybe when I play bad, and make just one mistake, it allows opponents to play well and get the 90% accuracy. It is weird, especially on Blitz.

I feel like the 1600s are more tryhards so you don't really expect it and play worse than you should

It's the 1700-1800 blitz death spiral intermediates get into

Yeah, I think you are right..

I have played a HUGE number of games on here-- 10s of thousands. It is very hard to get above 1800 on Blitz unless you have a certain kind of talent. Players REALLY do know their openings, the tactics, and how win an endgame.

On Rapid, I reached 2100 playing much the same quality of chess. I guess I think longer and harder because there is more time available-- perhaps that makes all the difference? But I do honestly think Blitz is 200-300 points harder. Try a new opening against a 1900 on Rapid and you will have the same success against a 1600-1700 player on Blitz.

1600s-1800s are there either the adults that play for years are or the talented people get get good ina couple years past of the issue is the adjustment to playing style is really painful plus 1600-1800 is the range before cheating starts to get incredibly difficult (even if most don't cheat )

Agreed. You know what you are talking about .

A strange thing I noticed about chess accuracy is that ONE mistake makes all the difference. If one player makes an error, the other player will see the right move and suddenly every move is easier for them. It is like the saying.. "the winner is the player who makes the next to last mistake".

And in openings, especially well known ones, even an inaccuracy can lead to one player playing like a dummy and the other player suddenly becoming Magnus Carlsen for a few moves. It is weird who it works. It is like a balance, and once one side gets an edge, it begins to swing their way.

I just force them to make a mistake if I made one it's not that hard to play down a piece in certain positions

Really? You mean a pawn down? Or a whole piece like a knight or a bishop?

I guess it depends on the clock. I play 5-0 and once you have the opponent at 1 min 30 they really need to have a checkmate in sight or you can beat them on time.

And Blitz does favor players who like adversity and are willing to battle on to the very end. A lot of games can be pulled from the fire.

ChrisZifo
chesssblackbelt wrote:

Anyway people really exaggerate how good 2k+ is

They just think it's amazing because it's above their own rating but it's mid

I was pretty happy to reach 2000 on Rapid and have never reached it on Blitz. And it puts you in the 99.9 percentile. Certainly something to be pleased with!

I wouldn't call it "mid" level but then again, Hikaru is what 3000, so maybe you could look at it on those terms.

BigChessplayer665
ChrisZifo wrote:
chesssblackbelt wrote:

Anyway people really exaggerate how good 2k+ is

They just think it's amazing because it's above their own rating but it's mid

I was pretty happy to reach 2000 on Rapid and have never reached it on Blitz. And it puts you in the 99.9 percentile. Certainly something to be pleased with!

I wouldn't call it "mid" level but then again, Hikaru is what 3000, so maybe you could look at it on those terms.

The percentile doesn't show the quality of skill at all 2000s arnt as good as you think

Part of the reason the statistic is a bit weird is cause it's a curve it looks like much more of a leap than it is once you get to 2000+ it feels a lot easier

ChrisZifo
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Right, that is the human element!

Even players above that level have tiredness, distractions, the odd opening they dont know well.. and so on. Even the GMs do stupid stuff some times.

As for resigning quickly, I think it is a mark of a better and more intelligent player. At the level I play at, some people play on to the very end when it is obvious they will lose. And an annoying number of players just do pathetic stuff like let the clock run down, disconnect or trash talk in the chat

BigChessplayer665
ChrisZifo wrote:
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Right, that is the human element!

Even players above that level have tiredness, distractions, the odd opening they dont know well.. and so on. Even the GMs do stupid stuff some times.

As for resigning quickly, I think it is a mark of a better and more intelligent player. At the level I play at, some people play on to the very end when it is obvious they will lose. And an annoying number of players just do pathetic stuff like let the clock run down, disconnect or trash talk in the chat

Actually resigning quickly is the mark of a worse chess player knowing when to resign is different

Here's an example of how not to resign https://lichess.org/AZ8wTxdqxOGc

BigChessplayer665
chesssblackbelt wrote:

I think this is one of them things where your views change when it happens to you because I used to think 2k was godly as well

Never happened to me I just viewed them as obnoxious

IloveIllinois
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Wow, that gives me a lot of hope that I could get to that level 1 day.

BigChessplayer665
IloveIllinois wrote:
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Wow, that gives me a lot of hope that I could get to that level 1 day.

Being 2000 unfortunately does not mean you don't get tunnel vision tho doesn't mean you'll get that lucky till you reach it typically unless the 2000 is having a really really bad day

BigChessplayer665
IloveIllinois wrote:
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Wow, that gives me a lot of hope that I could get to that level 1 day.

You actually should see my record against lower rated players (under 1800 ) it's not good...

BigChessplayer665
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:
chesssblackbelt wrote:
BigChessplayer665 wrote:
IloveIllinois wrote:

1600 is definitely an advanced intermediate player.

No it's more like "hay i have been playing and grinding for 2 years " why do I hang pieces by move 5 ?!

I had 3 weird games today...

1st one a 2100 hangs a piece on move 3 and resigns

2nd one a 2200 hangs a queen on move 4

3rd one a 2200 hangs a queen in the middle game and resigns

Wow, that gives me a lot of hope that I could get to that level 1 day.

Being 2000 unfortunately does not mean you don't get tunnel vision tho doesn't mean you'll get that lucky till you reach it typically unless the 2000 is having a really really bad day

I'll edit this

It's unlikely that you will get lucky but try your best you will literally never know what happens maybe they will hang mate in one like hikaru

IloveIllinois

I am not that far away, so I think I could do it without luck

BigChessplayer665
IloveIllinois wrote:

I am not that far away, so I think I could do it without luck

Luck is better and more fun it is useful for swindling a combination of luck and skill is probably best