Three Fold Repetition
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Would anyone happen to know?
If someone could please help me with this?
If it occurs the "offer draw" button will change to a "claim draw" button.
The three fold repetition rule is supposed to apply. I've never had it in one of my games so I can't say for sure. The staff has said the "offer draw" button is supposed to change to "claim draw" if the position is repeated 3 times. I have seen a couple say on the forums that the button didn't change, so I don't know.
I've had a couple of incidences involving the 3 fold repetition rule on this site, and it works perfectly, as described 2 posts above.
Yip me too. It works.
According to FIDE, in official games one can only offer/claim a draw for whatever reason after one has moved but before stopping one's clock. Since clocks are automatically stopped by moving here, what are the specific rules that apply to draws on this site?
I know recently I had a game where I was in trouble, and I felt lucky that my opponent repeated the position. After he moved into the position for the third time it was my move but the offer draw button appeared as "Claim Draw" as described above.
I clicked it without moving and the game was ended as a draw.
There are times when the "claim draw" button appears and times when it doesn't after a position appears for the third time. There must be some reason for this. In the one game I'm familiar with where the claim draw button failed to appear, the position was reached on the first 2 occassions on player #2's turn. On the third occassion the position occurred on player #1's turn. Since player #1 was losing, he tried to claim a draw when the position occurred the third time, but the "claim draw" button never apeared. This leads me to believe there is some specific rule that's not documented.
batgirl, I just wondered what you meant by "familiar with"... were you playing or watching or is this hearsay? I ask this because in one of my games the opponent messaged me, saying he couldn't see the button to claim the draw, although on further inspection he found it.
batgirl, in the case you describe the rules of chess are clear. "The position" includes whose move it is, not just where the pieces are. So, the pieces have to be on the same squares with the same side to move 3 times before a draw can be claimed.
In the US Chess Federation rules, when the position is on the board for the third time, the same player has to be on the move, with the same possible moves. If the possibility of castling is not present or absent all three times, the same moves are not possible. If capturing en passant was possible once, and the position was repeated, such a capture would not be possible. This means a fourth "repetition" would be the third.
Wow.. Loomis and GreenLaser.. I was unaware of that point. Thank you.
hearsay, as well as inspecting the game. Finding the button wasn't the problem- that the button hadn't changed to "claim" was his problem.
" in the case you describe the rules of chess are clear."
Well, I'm not so sure they're clear. I am just now looking at the FIDE rule book (which I should have done first).
If anything, it's confusing:
The game is drawn, upon a correct claim by the player having the move, when the same position, for at least the third time (not necessarily by a repetition of moves)
is about to appear, if he first writes his move on his scoresheet and declares to the arbiter his intention to make this move, or
has just appeared, and the player claiming the draw has the move.
Positions as in (a) and (b) are considered the same, if the same player has the move, pieces of the same kind and colour occupy the same squares, and the possible moves of all the pieces of both players are the same. Positions are not the same if a pawn that could have been captured en passant can no longer in this manner be captured or if the right to castle has been changed temporarily or permanently.
But it apparently is saying that EVERYTHING about the position must be the same, except how that position was arrived at.
The en-passant and castling part of the rule is illogical. If there are no new possibilities for the side to move, why would the game proceed differently? Eliminating possibilities that weren't chosen the first time around won't lead to new play the 3rd time around. So, it's illogical for en-passant and castling rights to make a difference.
shrug.
it is what it is.
GreenLaser really should have his title displayed beside his name.
Loomis, it may be illogical, but i's what the folks at FIDE decided in Dresden 2005, and what players are expected to follow in tournament games.
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/geurt90.pdf
I've been playing a few games on this site and I've been wondering if the Three Fold Repetition rule applies. If so, how do you invoke it?